April 1, 2002
Read this and thought of Mormonism--
"The more fictitious one's history becomes, the more one is doomed to encounter one's true past."
April 1, 2002
Are there any major theological differences between Reorganized LDS and regular LDS?
[Web-editor: See this page: The Reorganized LDS Church.]
April 3, 2002
Thank you again for the many fine books I've bought from you. They have given me many insights into what was once for me the 'OTC' or only true church.... May your ministry continue to help people through the 'Dark Night of the Soul,' to bring them into direct contact with the True Master, our Savior Jesus the Messiah.
April 3, 2002
Subject: book of enoch
Hi.....I have enjoyed many of your publications. I grew up mormon and are currently studying materials the...bishop would not approve of. I have enjoyed your web site.....thanks for helping inform me.
Question: I read in No Man Knows My History that Joseph Smith received a "revelation" and labeled it the book of Enoch......it supposedly was published in the original pearl of great price.....it is no longer in the Pof GP......do you know anything about this "revelation" and why it is no longer scripture?
[Sandra's Note: The text of the Book of Moses has been rearranged. Originally, in the 1851 Pearl of Great Price, the Book of Moses started out with "Extracts from the Prophecy of Enoch, ..." This section has now been moved and starts at Moses 6:43. See our Flaws in the Pearl of Great Price.]
April 3, 2002
As a "Mormon" I can only reply to your website with the statement that Christ has always been and will always be the center, the "Rock" on which my testimony has come. ....I do not wish to start a great dialogue regarding points and counterpoints. God sent his Holy Spirit to me years ago and no amount of "education" about the faults or imperfections of humans and their endeavors can remove from me what God our Father has revealed to me. ...
Joseph Smith was a man. A human man, imperfect and challenged by a calling anyone would be inadequate to fulfill. ...Jesus is the message. Joseph Smith was only a servant and messenger. If he were never to falter he would be unique among all prophets, apostles and others (save Jesus & the Father), in recorded biblical history. Joseph Smith is not the focus now, nor ever in the Church of Jesus Christ. He serves as a restorer of focus on our Savior. ...
I can't help but wonder if you have scrutinized your current religion so thoroughly as you have the Church of Jesus Christ. The testimony you received from the Holy Spirit told you of Christ's divinity and existence. Please do not persecute lovers of the Savior. Disagree with the religions of the world and heaven all you want, but what profiteth it to do so against a church who loves the dear Lord and seeks to worship and be more like him? ...
God Bless You, _____ ______
Just a man trying to be a good one.
April 3, 2002
I enjoyed reading your Messenger Issue 88 about the Legacy film. I agree with you that the film gives a terribly one-sided view of Mormon history. I also have enjoyed reading many of your other on-line articles. Thank you for doing such a great job at balancing the history books....
Let me make something clear. Although in my opinion you are being hypocritical for attacking Mormonism but leaving your own Christian religion untouched when Christianity suffers from the same kinds of problems, nevertheless, I think you should continue publicizing the faults of Mormonism. My wish is that you would realize that Christianity and all other faith-based, miracle-believing systems are similarly flawed.
I wrote you an email many months ago asking how you could be so good at revealing the problems of the Book of Mormon yet accept the problems of the Bible. Sandra graciously responded that at least the places described in the Bible actually existed. I disagreed with her, but thought I understood her position...
You did very well in your article about Brigham Young's Adam-God theology to show that earlier Mormon prophets preached things that aren't considered doctrine by Mormon leaders today. Keep up the good work!
However, what about ideas taught by early Christian fathers that some later leaders considered heresies? What about groups that called each other heretics and excommunicated each other? Can't you see that Mormons are suffering the same kinds of things that ancient Christians suffered? You happen to have a certain set of beliefs partly because those were the beliefs accepted by the groups that dominated in ancient debates. I think it was a question of whose ideas won out, not on who was on God's side. Isn't it possible that Christianity is just an especially enduring religion created by mere men without significant inspiration from God? I think so, but I guess you can't see that.
April 4, 2002
Hi, Services at the Mormon tabernacle (as seen on TV) are so ecumenical it's disgusting. I wish they knew more about Joe Smith not being able to translate Egyptian. They are good people...but they need Jesus Christ. Thanks for taking a stand like you do. Keep up the good work.
April 4, 2002
For the last couple of years, I've been using your website as a resource for my studies. I've grown up in the church, served a mission, married in the temple, etc.
For about the last 3 years, though, I've been doing some major soul searching about it. I'd read some information that didn't quite jibe with what I thought about the church. After some searching, I found your website, along with many others, both pro and con. Yours found to be the least vitriolic, though, so I stayed with yours more. Many of the books you sell, I've found in libraries, or on used books sites/stores, and read them enthusiastically. Needless to say, I was pretty shocked.
In an effort to dig out what was really true ( I had gotten to the point that either the church was true, or there was no God at all), ...I hit the scriptures full blown. I had never been a scriptorian, not even on my mission. But I studied, the Bible, the Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants, etc. I cross referenced (on my own, not the church's little aids) many of my questions.
I found that there are principles taught by the church that aren't in the scriptures. What I did find though, is that it didn't matter. I proved to myself that the Church is true. That the reason some of these doctrines aren't in the 'quad' is that we are led by a prophet.
It was enough to scare the heck out of me, that's for sure. I was pretty much set to send my letter to the bishop. The gist of this letter, though is one of thanks. Though I didn't get the answer you probably were expecting, I got a true answer, and I can thank you for helping me find all the necessary information.
Yes, there is so much that is confusing out there, I was shaken for almost 3 years by it all, but it all comes together, and makes so much sense. ...
Your friend, always
April 4, 2002
Dear Sandra & Gerald
...God bless you for your efforts and work to expose Mormonism. I pray for you often. The first publication of yours I ever read was "MormonismShadow or Reality?" It is one of the most compelling books I ever read. I still refer to it from time to time.
In Christ's love,
April 5, 2002
I DO SO enjoy reading those emails from LDS and non-LDS alike. I'm especially interested in those unfavorable one (q.v. the one which referred to your site as a "campaign of lies". I suppose this dear soul needs to dust off his Book of Mormon, Doctrine & Covenants and History of the Church volumes and check out these "lies" for himself. It's amazing what he might find. But alas; such effort is hard work; and it's much easier to sit back and believe as one is told.
Now for the main event of this email. A few years back I read where one of you commented on Book of Commandments, VI (which later became Doctrine & Covenants, VI). As you are aware, this supposed "translation" of an ancient "parchment", handwritten by John the Beloved, expanded by some 109 words....How did the men obtain this "parchment"?.... What is your view of this "growing" translation? As a translator of Greek and Coptic Biblical texts, I am interested to know.
[Sandra's Note: Joseph Smith never claimed to have an actual ancient text, merely a 'revelation' as to what John was supposed to have written. Since the original printing in the Book of Commandments agrees with the manuscripts one must conclude that Smith simply claimed 'further revelation'. The Mormons attack the Bible as unreliable claiming wicked men made unfounded changes. Yet Smith can just change his revelations and 'translations' whenever he wants, adding or changing doctrines, without the need to conform to the earliest manuscripts.
The most complete study of the changes in the Doctrine and Covenants is The Joseph Smith's Revelations Text & Commentary by Marquardt. A shorter overview of the major changes is in our book Case Against Mormonism, Vol.1.]
April 6, 2002
Hello Sandra & Jerald,
...In recent years I've been a fan of CRI's ministry...I was very happy to hear this week's "BAM" program where Sandra's forward to Richard Abanes' new book [One Nation Under Gods] were read, and Richard praised the research work that you do!
I thank God for you often because of how you have stood in difficult times for His truth. For example, several years ago, your stand on the "white salamander letter" brought criticism from a number of...ministries, but you continued to stand for what you believed to be the truth. Eventually, you were vindicated, but this doesn't always happen.
So, keep up the good work!...your faithfulness is winning souls!
April 6, 2002
To whom it mayy concern,
I don't feel that this website is focussing on the right idea. You claim to be members of the christian faith yet the whole purpose of this web site is to disprove or falsify the LDS faith. I come from a southern baptist faith and I was converted into mormonism when I was the age of 18.
There is one thing that completely sets the LDS church apart from all of the others faiths that I have been associated with in my short life time. That is that when I walk into a LDS chapel I don't find flyers and flyers on why the baptist church isnt true or the catholic or jewish for that matter. But every other church I have set foot into has had pamplets singled out why the LDS church isnt true and they are. ...
[Sandra's Note: The whole premise of Mormonism is that all other churches are in total apostasy and only the LDS Church is accepted by God. Joseph Smith claimed in his first vision, as told in the Pearl of Great Price, that God announced to Smith that ALL churches were "an abomination" to Him. Pamphlets containing this story are passed out by the LDS missionaries all the time. Here is a quote directly from Smith as recorded in LDS scripture:
Since Joseph Smith proclaimed that all other churches were in total apostasy and that only the LDS Church, and its ordinances, could lead a person back to the presence of God the Father, one can hardly be surprised that people of other churches would question his claims. Why should anyone accept his word or accept him as a prophet? We believe that the facts of his life clearly demonstrate that he was not such a prophet.
We believe everyone needs to come to a true faith in Christ, Mormons included. Mormon teachings lead away from the Bible (by saying it has been changed and is not complete) and depend on belief in Smith, his revelations, and temple marriage. This is adding to the gospel of Jesus. Christ paid it all. What more could a sinful person add? Salvation (ETERNAL LIFE) is by GRACE. If a person truly places his/her full trust in Christ and His atonement for eternal life they would realize that they don't need temple marriage. When LDS say a person can go to heaven and be saved but not have eternal life (exaltation) they are changing the gospel (condemned in Gal. 1:8-9). To be "saved" is to have "eternal life"—the Bible never separates them into two different things as the Mormons do (1 John 5:11-13). I do not assume Mormons are saved (have eternal life), I obviously worry that they are not. Otherwise, I wouldn't spend all this effort trying to reach them.]
April 7, 2002
Dear Sir: I was wondering if you could confirm some current statistics for me. I recently watched "The God Makers." It looked like it was produced in the 70's. It Utah as having the highest national average in: depression, suicide, and divorce. As a Nationally Certified Psychologist, I found this very interesting but very logical. Do you have any current statistics on these three area?
Grace and Peace,
[Sandra's Note: Yes, the Godmakers is out of date. Utah does not have the highest rates, but above average.
In 1993 the Salt Lake Tribune stated:
In 1996 the Salt Lake Tribune reported:
In 1998 the Salt Lake Tribune stated:
In 1999 the Salt Lake Tribune reported:
In 2001 the Provo Herald reported:
April 7, 2002
Subject: I feel for you.
My heart breaks for you -- to be known the world over as perhaps the greatest apostates the church has ever known. I honestly hope there is a time for forgiveness.
Best of luck,
April 8, 2002
Subject: Thank You for being there!
I would just like to thank you for having this web site. My wife is in transition from Mormonism. We have found this Web Site very informative and very supportive. After 45 years of "being brainwashed" (her words not mine,) she all of a sudden decided that she could no longer believe in the Mormon Church. She has been away from the church for two years now and is still doing research.
April 9, 2002
I am a mormon and when I read your Question and Answer about Mormon I am so feel sorry about your comments. I don't want to waste my time finding the truth because the truths will reveal itself ....you think you better than us. You attack mormon, so what is the good that you have. I don't believe in you a bit about attack the Mormon. I laugh when I read your theory. Please read more and pray about what you teach if it will really close to the truth. Have a nice research and by the way please go to church on SUNDAY.
April 9, 2002
Subject: Is there some sort of Mormon Doctrine for Lying?
I know that sounds like a weird question; but, I am really very serious. My best freind is a TBM (True Blue Mormon ... I just learned that term today from your website.) After her husband of 33 years left her for another Mormon, my friend has been questioning the church.
I have known for many years that my friend LIES when the topic is The Mormon Church. Does the church teach members to do that? Are lies condoned by the church when members want to conceal church practices from outsiders. This may seem like a rhetorical question, but I assure you I am very sincere in my need to know.
Recently, I thought that my friend was really going to leave the church. It is the true desire of my heart that she accept Jesus Christ as her Saviour. I see now (from your website) that my friend is really accurate when she tells me, "It's not that simple (to leave the church)."
I've known for years that she lies about the church, but I don't understand that secrecy. Can you help me understand?
[Sandra's Note: From the earliest days of Mormonism, Joseph Smith covered up his secret practice of polygamy. This created an atmosphere of lying and justifying the cover-up. The 1835 edition of the Doctrine and Covenants contained a denial of polygamy (see our newsletter: #66 Messenger: Polygamy and Truth). In one of Smith's last sermons he denied his practice of polygamy (see History of the Church, vol.6, pp. 408-412) . Also, his purported translation of the Book of Abraham contains a story of God commanding Abraham to lie (See Pearl of Great Price, Book of Abraham 2:22-25).
Smith also introduced secret temple rituals and had a secret Council of Fifty as part of his quest to set up the political kingdom of God on earth. (see Mormon Hierarchy: Origins of Power by Quinn) Thus Mormonism developed a rationalization for hiding their real teachings and agenda.
In general the LDS Church advises its members to be honest, yet they practice a system of cover-up and deceit when it comes to their controversial teachings.]
April 9, 2002
Subject: Illinois and Ohio Bigamy Laws
I recently resigned from the LDS Church after 33 years "under the covenant". My parents enlisted the help of two SHIELDS apologists to refute my assertions about Mormonism's white-washed (re-engineered would be more accurate) history. After a brief exchange, they grew conspicuously silent. :-)
In the course of the brief debate, they challenged my assertion that bigamy was illegal in Illinois since 1833. I used D. Michael Quinn's essay on the topic as my source. Can you provide me with the full text of the law or another reliable source I can quote on the topic?...
One more thing. My friends from SHIELDS felt the law was irrelevant since there was no way to prove that Joseph had a knowledge of the law. After pointing out that it is safe to assume that the Lord knew about the law when he sent his angel with the drawn sword to force Joseph to begin the practice, I offered the following theory:
I have discovered the answer to the question surrounding the beginnings of polygamy in contradiction to secular law. The blame rests squarely on the Angel wielding the unsheathed sword. ...
[Web-editor: See #97 Messenger: Plural Marriage Illegal.]
April 9, 2002
I just received your 'MormonismShadow or Reality.' Thank you. I am enjoying it very much, I am already having a change of heart. We appreciate what you are doing and look forward to many more year's of knowledge.
April 9, 2002
Subject: I want to know more
...I was given a copy of your Salt Lake City Messenger, Utah Lighthouse Ministry newsletter issue no. 76. I was quite startled by what it contained. I left the Mormon church in 1970. I have as of yet to have my name taken off the membership. I will certainly do so now. I thank you for all your years of hard work. If it is meant to be seen, it will. ...
April 9, 2002
Date April 9, 2002
Would appreciate any information on LDS doctrine concerning Atonement for sin obtained in Garden of Gethsemane not on the cross. Wow, am I confused re this one.
[Web-editor: See Gethsemane and Christ's Blood in LDS References]
April 9, 2002
...I am a mormon by birth and my family too ....you were all once a mormon and you know that "Faith is believing in things that are not seen" i believe the church is true and i know in my heart that joseph smith is the prophet of Heavenly Father and i would like to correct that...we mormons believe in Jesus Christ as our Saviour and Redeemer ...thank you for giving me the chance to hear my side and i will like to tell you that i am born a mormon gain my own testimony and i will never fall apart....i say things to be true in jesus christ name. amen
April 9, 2002
Subject: Thank You
Sandra, My brother and I called upon you last month at your bookstore. I very much appreciated the time you took to tell us your story. I just wanted to say thank you for the time you spent with us and for the work you and Jerald are doing. I look forward to my next trip to Salt Lake so I can visit your bookstore again.
April 9, 2002
I don't understand why everyone wants to put down Latter Day Saints. Why is it that when one mistake happens or something that happens in the church that suddenly everyone must all put their 2 cents in? Take the beam out of your own eye first before you go putting down on us.
April 10, 2002
Hi, I am a ex mormon who made it out, alot of it was due to your web site, I constantly read many of the replies that criticizing another religion is 'wrong'.
So lets look at this. When Jesus said 'Woe to you Scribes and Pharisees', in MT 23:17 he was being UNCHRISTIAN. He definitely was attacking another belief system, and I guess when Jude the author of Jude wrote to 'Contend for the Faith', the Holy Spirit was being 'UNCHRISTIAN'.
The Hypocrisy of practicing mormons is further laid bare, in that their own religion as part of their own scriptures teaches in the first vision all other Christian Sects are Wrong. I guess they must admit themselves to be UNCHRISTIAN by their own self imposed definition.
April 10, 2002
Subject: Joseph & Brigham's teachings
...I am interested to know if there is any place where Joseph and/or Brigham said that no Mormon (saint) at any time, then or future, could disregard or ignore any of the teachings of either man, because they were the unchanging truth from God for eternity?
[Sandra's Note: Mormon scriptures state:
Brigham Young stated:
Hope this helps.]
April 11, 2002
Subject: Just a Thought
I find it ironic and somewhat hypocritical that active Mormons will criticize your site by saying such things as "Why do you feel it necessary to tear down another's faith." I would pose the same question back at them. After all, don't they do the same by stating that all other churches are an abomination and have no authority? Isn't the first lesson or teaching or whatever they call it designed to "tear down" or invalidate one's faith in order to replace it with the view of Mormonism?
April 11, 2002
Dear Jerald and Sandra Tanner,
A friend and I, both ex-Mormons got talking today and in the course of the conversation discovered that we both had the same "New Name" given in the temple. Our question is, how many total "New Names" are there so we can calculate the odds of our having the same one. I have checked all the bulletin boards and can not really find any other place to ask this question. If you know of a web site that I can go to in order to find the answer to this, I would appreciate it.
Thank you for your time.
[Sandra's Note: I believe each temple has a year-long list of names, one each (male and female) for each day it is open, and then repeats them the next year. So everyone going through the endowments on April 12th could be Mary and Joseph, April 13th could be Adam and Eve, etc. I am not sure that all the temples use the same names on the same day, but they all use the same, or similar list, which are generally scripture or European royalty names.]
April 11, 2002
...I admire the role that you and Jerald have played in the Mormon saga, especially in publishing suppressed documents. ...
April 12, 2002
I was reading some of the comments from mormons who responded to your website. I wanted to let them know what has been my experience with the mormon church. I will not refer to the mormon church as latter day saints or what ever they are calling it now.
I was born into the church and baptized in the church and all the things that are done to young children to complete their brainwashing. I was abused from 5 years old till I was 18. Not only was I abused by my parents, but from the bishop and other ward members. My uncle who is a police officer and a member of the bishopric witnessed my father beating me and my brothers and stood by and watched it happen. He did not report it to his station, but chose to keep it to himself and the other members of the bishopric.
My parents have never been condemned or punished in any way. They go to the temple and pray and get their bodies blessed or whatever it is they do there and continue to do so to this day. If a temple is so sacred why are the members who are child abusers getting in with out difficulty? My guess is they pay their 10% entrance fee and no one cares about anything else.
You all heard the "want-to-be" prophet condemn child abuse this last Sunday, but the church is unwilling to "right their wrongs", afraid to lose money I think they are! Would God prefer the mormon church to build more temples and churches then to compensate the children who have been abused. The facts of the mormon (NOT THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER DAY SAINTS) church are this; they love money, they don't want to lose money, They have no humility (as evidenced by the largest conference center in the world) and more churches than anyone else, they do not seek repentance, but chose to hide the abuse of children to protect their wallets, and finally THE MORMONS WHO WALK THE HALLS OF THE TEMPLES, WALK WITH CHILD ABUSERS, CHILD RAPISTS, AND BRAINWASHERS IN THE NAME OF MONEY. THAT SOUNDS LIKE HELL TO ME, NOT HEAVEN...I would also like to say that when I was growing up in the mormon church EVERYONE in the church referred to the church as "mormon" not "latter day saints". Is this yet another "revelation that they should not be called mormons?
I was born in the mormon church and I lived the horror of being a mormon child and I will call mormons, "mormons", not members of the church of Jesus Christ of latter day saints, because they are not. Many a mormon has spilled my blood, the blood of an innocent, frightened young boy, sexual abused and raped by other's in the church. ...
April 12, 2002
Subject: comments on your mission
...I am amazed that anyone would devote all their life energies to tear down another religion. I may not agree with the Catholic church, being born and raised in it, but, would never dream of spending all my energies to destroy it. The same goes for other denominations I don't especially agree with. So I applaud the meek nature of this church.
I am reminded of the Apostle Paul of the early church days, who thought it was his mission to stone and destroy the early saints. Saul had to be stopped by Christ Himself to change his behavior. We live in a nation that tolerates even Muslims. And we are finding out that they aren't a religion of peace. But, because we are a country who believes in freedom of worship, we give the freedom to practice whatever they believe in. It is up to the individual to accept or deny any teachings that he/she abhors. ...
April 13, 2002
Subject: Loved your site!
My dearest brother and sister in Christ,
Just a brief note to make you aware of my love for the two of you. I left Mormonism years ago, and I delight in your work. I loved your books, which I purchased, and one day hope to meet the two of you. You are truly special gifts from God for those of us who left Mormonism but gained a faith in our Lord.
Please, please, please continue your work. Of all the books on Mormonism I have read, Shadow and Reality remains my favorite! The close runner up is Ms. Brodie's biography on Joseph. I am so touched at how your work never reaches anger or bitterness. One day I will make a pilgrimage to your bookstore!...
Your loving brother in Christ,
April 13, 2002
Subject: God bless you
May God bless you in your effort of bringing mormons to Christ....
April 13, 2002
Dear Friends in Christ,
Despite our religious education and warnings, our eldest son has fallen in love with the daughter of a Mormon Bishop and is persuaded that we, as outsiders to the Mormon faith, have been mislead and are confused...as are nearly all who are Evangelical Christians and 'outsiders'.
He is merely reiterating the catechism that has been relayed to him by his girlfriend. One of the saddest parts of this story is that she has been so good for [our son] in so many ways. They are very much in love. She has felt the pull to separate from the Mormon Church and does not feel comfortable with many aspects. She wavers. She is conflicted. [Our son] rides the wave of her emotions, feelings and desires. I think that T........is the key. If we can manage to minister to T....... without her feeling that we are being intrusive or judgemental and without [our son] 'coming to her rescue' around those feelings - perhaps there is a chance.....
April 14, 2002
Subject: My testimony
Dear Editor, ...I would like to share my feelings regarding the Book of Mormon. I am only 16 years old but I have been raised in The LDS Church all of my life. I know it is true. I used to doubt the Book of Mormon, but then I realized my heart was hardened and so the Spirit could not testify to me that it was true.
I just want to say that you will never ever ever gain a testimony of anything if you take every little thing apart. That is why we are being tested, to see if we can depend on the Spirit for strength. Did you know that? What you are doing with this website appears to me that you are relying on science for your answers. Science and religion are two different things and you cannot put those two together. You must gain a testimony for yourself. If you will pray with ALL your heart and ask if the Book of Mormon is true, then the Spirit will calmly whisper to you that it is. I know it will. It has happened to me. ...I have already read the Book of Mormon 5 times and every time I do, I feel renewed. ...It is a perfect book. It holds the keys to eternity. It is my strength and I hope that one day it will be yours. I testify that it is true in the name of Jesus Christ, Amen.
[Sandra's Note: Thanks for writing. I accept that you are sincere in your beliefs, but sincerity is not a guarantee of truth. Obviously there are many sincere, praying people around the world coming up with different answers. I am not speaking against prayer, just that if we rely solely on our subjective feelings we can reach a false conclusion.
As a Mormon I DID read the Book of Mormon and pray about it. I believe that God led me to the evidence to show me that the book was not from Him. I find it curious that at the front of the Book of Mormon it says the angel told Smith 'that the FULNESS of the everlasting Gospel was contained in it' yet it does not teach the major doctrines of Mormonism. Where in the Book of Mormon does it teach plural gods, pre-mortal existence, eternal progression, three levels of heaven, baptism for the dead, temple marriage, or Melchezedic priesthood?
How are we to detect the false Christs and false prophets Jesus warned against? (see Matthew 24:24, 'For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.' ) Paul says in Gal. 1:8-9 that we are to compare their teachings with that of the apostles and reject any that teach different doctrines.
Truth will stand up to investigation. Peter wrote 'we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were EYEWITNESSES OF HIS MAJESTY.' (2 Peter 1:16) Peter was making an appeal on the basis of actual events, not just a feeling from prayer. When Paul went to preach in Berea the people 'searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so, therefore many of them believed.' (Acts 17:11-12) Notice, they believed because they studied it, they did not just rely on their feelings. They were commended for their efforts to research Paul's claims.
Subjective feelings can deceive us. Jesus said He is the way the TRUTH and the life. We must be committed to following TRUTH if we are His disciple. If Joseph Smith could lie to his wife and the world about polygamy, saying he was not practicing it at a time he had at least 33 wives (a number of which were already married to living husbands), how can we ever know when to trust him? I hope you will continue to read and study. The Joseph Smith of the LDS PR department is very different from the historical man.]
April 14, 2002
I am a Mormon. I have been a member of the church since the mid '70's. My wife joined the church shortly after we were married but never really gained a testimony that the church is the true church of Jesus Christ. She recently wrote the Bishop in our ward and requested that her name be removed from the roles of the church.
I read some of the anti-Mormon literature she has been reading that bears your web address at the bottom of it. I am assuming she printed it from your web site. ...I think all church members and especially church leaders will tell you that they are imperfect. That we all have flaws in our character and that we are striving to become as Jesus Christ. Patient, long suffering, full of love and having a desire to serve our fellow man.
As a Mormon I pray to the God that created the heavens and the earth. I believe that all of those who pray to the God that created the heavens and the earth are praying to the same God that I pray to. And this regardless of the fact that they are Methodist, Lutheran, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, or any other faith that recognizes there is a God.
The fact that my wife is no longer counted as a member of the church does not alter my love for her in any way. I feel very fortunate to be married to her and to share the brief time we have together here upon the earth. ...
I don't know that my wife will ever know the truth while she is yet here upon the earth. I hope and pray each day of my life that she may be given to see things as they really are.
As for you anti-Mormons that spread hate and discontent amongst the citizens, I hope the Lord will forgive you as I have forgiven you. It matters not to me what religion a man is. It matters only that he is patient, long suffering, meek, humble, full of love and has a firm desire to serve his fellow man. Never the less, I accept all people for what they are and what they desire. If we would all concentrate on the betterment of our civilization and conservation of our resources the world would be a much better place. Please stop tearing down the good works of others. I urge you to take a good look at what you are doing with this web site and ask yourself if this is what Jesus Christ would do with his time if He were upon the earth today. I hope and pray that all men will live together in harmony and promote the will of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. These things I say humbly in Jesus name, amen.
April 14, 2002
ok i really dont get you, you guys say you are so good. i never herd the lds church saying crap about another church. why do you do this to them, they are good people just look at them. they are the most healthy, they are smart and everything. a normal person isnt look at the prophet the is 91 years old and he doesnt even act like it, to me that is something amaizing. plus doesnt christ say in the bible to that contention is of the devil and what are you doing how can you say you are right if you are cousing contintion. it doesnt make sence. i am a fall away from the church, i know for a fact that it is true but it is too hard for me to do the commandments of God. saten wants us to fall away to temptation
April 15, 2002
Subject: Leaving Mormonism
Dear, blessed, Jerald and Sandra, Well, I finally did it! Today I mailed my letters to officially remove my name from the Mormon Church! I have denounced Mormonism for 12 years, but never thought it important to be removed from their records, until now. Along with your site and other God inspired folks, I have learned so much more regarding the falsehoods of this Cult and wish to be completely disassociated with it! Thank you!
I have placed my order for Mormonism—Shadow or Reality? and eagerly anticipate it's arrival. It is my prayer that, with your guidance, I can assist my family in also seeing God's light and truth! Please pray that they will see the errors of this religion and leave it as quickly as I did! Thank you for following God's calling!
Blessings to you and your family,
April 15, 2002
Subject: Your recommendation
What might you suggest that we order if you were going to recommend ONE book to donate to our local library (or for that matter, to give to someone) to address the errors of Mormonism, or to combat their doctrines. Thanks.
[Sandra's Note: You have asked a hard question. I think one must make a distinction between what to place in a library and what might be best to give to a particular individual. Is the person taking the LDS missionary lessons, already a member, been through the temple? If the person is already a Mormon it is harder to get them to read something by an outsider, so it takes a little different approach. They already know they believe differently than standard Christians, they simply trust their prophet above the Bible.
So then it becomes a matter of establishing that Smith isn't trustworthy before they will care what the Bible says. In such a case we might be able to get a Mormon to read Studies of the Book of Mormona manuscript written by LDS leader B.H. Roberts and published after his death. Roberts stayed a Mormon leader but obviously had secret doubts about the historicity of the Book of Mormon. Another good book to give to a Mormon, especially a woman, is Mormon Enigma: Emma Hale Smithwritten by two LDS women historians. This documents Joseph's early life, his money-digging, etc. and his involvement with other women, Emma's (his wife) struggles with polygamy and Smith's lies about it. Since these books are sold at the LDS bookstore, Deseret Book (801-328-8191), a Mormon might agree to read them but not be willing to read anything by a non-Mormon.
Other good general books on LDS history are:
Good books on doctrine are:
April 15, 2002
Just stumbled across your site...I have recently begun to look into Mormon 'origins' myself and even though your site plainly throws a sackfull of implied character flaws at the Smith family, I am just curious...How is it that such a devout group of people (followers of this Joseph Smith), who surely knew of him, his associates, and likely even personally knew of his family history, could subscribe to his story and teachings if the scenario you claim as researched fact actually took place as you describe? Your portrayal seems a bit unbelievable knowing what those followers sacrificed.
It comes across as a stretching of facts - that may have some basis in truth - to lean toward your own personal opinions. ...Before I can totally dispel the allegation that Joseph Smith was a money-grubbing gold-digger, what specific, and credible, historical information has been found to discredit his character?
...Are you promoting anti-Mormon sentiment only? I don't believe I saw any reference to your position on any other religion, Christianity, or the belief in God as a whole. ...Before I can believe what you say is the 'true beginning' of the Mormon church OR believe what the Mormon's say is the true beginning of their faith, I would have to be able to take who is telling the tale into consideration. What are specific examples of evidence of your position and where can they be found?
[Sandra's Note: Thanks for writing. I suspect you have been visiting a friend's site that posts some of our information. Our official site is www.utlm.org. There you will find material on our exit from the LDS Church, our faith in Christ, and the errors of Mormonism.
We believe that we can establish from reliable, accepted historical documents (both LDS and non-LDS) that Joseph Smith was a deceiver. Granted, we all have our flaws, and I do not demand perfection from God's servants. But I do expect a level of honesty and trustworthiness.
Just looking at Smith's practice of polygamy and how he lied about it, going behind his wife's back, lying to the public, disobeying the laws of Illinois, secretly marrying women who had living husbands, is enough to show that he was not to be trusted. If you will read either In Sacred Loneliness: The Plural Wives of Joseph Smith by Compton or Mormon Enigma: Emma Hale Smith by Newell and Averyboth books written by historians who are LDS and well respected in their fieldsyou will see the problem. (These books are also sold at the Deseret Book Store [official LDS store] here in Salt Lake City. You can verify this by calling them at 801-328-8191.)
All of our research, as well as that of the two books mentioned above, can be verified at universities here in Utah, such as the University of Utah or BYU. We do not expect anyone to just accept what we say without checking out the references, and we encourage people to do so.]
April 16, 2002
how do we deal with someone passing out what amounts to be false 'anti-mormon' (for lack of a better term) information? I grew up Mormon but do[n't] go their anymore. I don't quite agree with alot that's taught there anymore.
However, sometimes someone says the Mormon church teaches something it never has. I don't want to seem like I'm actually defending the Mormon church but I do think we, especially as Christians, have an obligation to be accurate in what we say about and to ANYONE, even if it's someone we disagree with. one person i listen to on the local Christian radio station...once said the Mormon church teaches that Joseph Smith died and shed his blood for sins of people, I never heard that taught from the pulpit nor have I ever seen THAT in any LDS print literature and I contacted him on this and let know politely that I do believe he's wrong on that.
[Sandra's Note: I agree, I do not like to hear people say untrue things about Mormonism or any other faith. It ruins the Christian's credibility when that happens.
I have heard Mormons compare Smith's death to Christ's, as they claim both gave their lives for the gospel, but have not heard a Mormon say Joseph died in the sense of an atonement for us. However, there are statements that elevate him to a position that seems as important as Jesus.
Brigham Young stated:
In the Ensign, June,1994, p.6-7 it says of Smith:
April 17, 2002
Subject: i support you guys
I wanted to send a note of encouragement! I am so encouraged by what yall are doing and I wanted to tell you that I really do praise God for people like you who can reach out to and care for Mormons and ex-Mormons.
God saved me and my next youngest sister from Mormonism, even though our entire family, extended too, disagrees and tells us about it! And I am so heartened to find out that [my sister] and I are not the only chirstians who used to be mormon! If you all ever hear of any kind of mission trip type of stuff that goes to Utah, please send me info....Thank you again for letting God lead yall to do this and reach so many people. I just thought of this: if you know any Beaches up there, you'll know that I'm related to them! If you know them, pray for them on my behalf: they are wonderful people and I pray so hard that Jesus leads them to come to really know HIM!
[Sandra's Note: Glad to hear about you and your sister. There are several groups that plan special mission trips to Utah. Here are the contacts for two of them.
Robert Sivulka, Utah Gospel Mission
Hope this helps.]
April 17, 2002
The fact that there are parallels to the New Testament and Book of Moses/Abraham is faith promoting.
[Sandra's Note: I guess I missed something in journalism classes in school. How is deliberate plagiarism 'faith promoting'?
There is no evidence that the text of the Book of Mormon, Book of Moses, or the text of the Book of Abraham existed prior to the writing of the New Testament (other than those places Smith copied from the English Bible).
The Bible, as well as Smith's scriptures, would have been originally written in a foreign language, not English. So any English wording in Smith's scriptures that parallels phrases in the Bible must be examples of deliberate plagiarism.]
April 17, 2002
You guys are doing awesome work for Jesus! Now I have the best source ever for responding to the confusing and frustrating arguments I hear from Mormons. Thank you!
April 18, 2002
Subject: Excellent work
Good job. you are being your brother's keeper.
April 18, 2002
I have read several of your online articles that are linked from exmormom.org. Thank you for your extensive research and arguments.
My wife and I are trying to learn what we can of the LDS church (her sister is a recent convert). In our readings of Mormon literature, several things just don't ring true to us. We find that you have researched many of our concerns and questions and give us a wealth of information to compare to the pro-LDS literature and discussions. ...God Bless,
April 19, 2002
...Another question I have need of help with, is does the CD with all the LDS doctrines on it, have the evidence of Joseph Smith having had a gun smuggled into the jail to him, and about whom he shot, etc.? My lds husband is beside himself, as I am trying to convert his mind away from mormonism,...and says THAT stuff is 'Just a lie'..even though he has been inactive, years, he still takes up for it...."Because his family is in it"..and sense you left that yourselves, can you share a small letter to my husband withsome sentiment toward him, in compassion, yet motivate him toward discovering the truth for himself, instead of dwelling in the gray matter, fume stuff, of thinking like the LDS church JUST CANT be fake..etc. This Dream World of in between-ness I have to put up with in him is like a great gulf between us, and like living with a person lost in a fog of belief, no matter what...like he is a mummy almost, rather a hypnotised mummy! ...Thanks,..
[Sandra's Note: The LDS cd-rom GospeLink2001 should have the History of the Church, by Joseph Smith, on it. It's available through DesesertBook.com: GospeLink 2001. Also see our page: Joseph Smith's Death.]
April 19, 2002
Subject: Garden of Eden
I recently read your article on the Garden of Eden at . Very nice, but it missed a major Joseph Smith fraud issue about which most LDS are unaware:
Moses 3:13-14 retains the Genesis account by placing Eden near Ethiopia, Assyria, and the Euphrates.
The Book of Moses revelation was received in 1830--before the saints ever moved to Missouri, and before Joseph ever got carried away with his Adamic revelations.
Aware of this contradiction, the LDS scholars who wrote the footnotes in the LDS scriptures attempted to explain that "In the area of Eden and Adam-ondi-Ahman, there were rivers and lands that received names that were later attached to other lands and rivers."
This explanation is impossible given the following:
Ethiopia: This is actually a Greek word. It means "sunburned faces". It applied to all peoples south of Egypt, including those in Ethiopia. The Greeks did not exist until after the flood and did not have an alphabet until after 1,500 BC. It is unlikely...err...impossible for this to have been a word for a land near Missouri (Eden) that later became attached to Ethiopia as we know it.
Assyria: The country known as Assyria in ancient times was actually known as Assur until sometime after 2,000 BC. Ashur was their God of military prowess and empire. The country was named after him, and sometime after 2,000 BC, that name evolved into Assyria. Once again, this natural evolution of the name is inconsistent with the footnote explanation.
April 21, 2002
Subject: ADD MINE TO ALL THE OTHERS.
Tanners, You must get a lot of this sort of mail and I do not doubt that it will fall on deaf ears, but I must in good faith tell you of the feelings that I have after reading your book.
I fell sorry for anyone that is so consumed, as you seem to be, with destroying what you were raised to believe. I can not understand anyone who waists their life in finding fault. Do you not know that contention is of the devil right or wrong?? Have you nothing better to do with your life?
I am not a member of the Mormon church, but was excommunicated 30 years ago for believing too much. In all of that time I have tried to keep from contending with the church. Let the Lord God bring to pass the setting in order! (sec 85 of the D&C) You have not got that calling.
P.S. I thank the Lord that I did not have to pay for that book of yours! As I got it from a friend.
April 21, 2002
Subject: When the Missionary Discussions come to Tithing
If you are taking the LDS Missionary Discussions and you have reached the point where they are talking about tithing you need to do the following:
If you are lucky to find a Bishop who actually knows what the LDS position is on tithing he will tell you that it is up to you to decide what your tithing is. He will tell you that an interpretation from the church leaders in 1970 suggests that the word "interest" means "income". If this was an actual "revelation" from God then it would have been added to the DOCTRINE AND COVENANTS. No such revelation has been published in new editions of the D&C.
What happens then, in most instances, is that you will be given promptings in various ways that are intended to convince you that if you do not give 10% of your gross income, you are shortchanging God. The public policy is to say that it is up to you. The reality is that you will be made to feel guilty or fear for your celestial inheritance if you do not give 10% of your gross income. The church leaders will claim that errors in the application of doctrine are at the local level and beyond their control. It is, of course, convenient that the church should benefit considerably from the error.
There is an old saying that "if you want to find the truth - follow the money". It applies in this instance as well. Taking excessive tithing from families is abusive to children. I am sorry if that fact hurts some people's feelings.
Don't get me wrong. I love "Mormons" and have a testimony of their sincere desire to be good Christians. I have also come to the conclusion that they are "ever seeking the truth" by looking in only the most "convenient" places.
Former Branch President
April 22, 2002
IT ALWAYS AMAZES ME HOW MANY WEB SITES TRY TO BASH MORMONISM. YOU HAVE NOT DISPROVED ANYTHING. YOU HAVE ONLY SHOWN YOUR IGNORANCE. KEEP TRYING THOUGH.
IT ALWAYS STRENGTHENS MY TESTIMONY MORE. WHEN YOU CAN TELL ME WHY A YOUNG BOY WITH LITTLE EDUCATION COULD MAKE UP A STORY WITH ALL THE DETAIL AND HISTORICAL INFORMATION, AND FLOW AS WELL AS THE BOOK OF MORMON DOES.
I HAVE TWO MASTERS DEGREES AND TRIED TO EVEN WRITE A SHORT STORY SIMILAR TO THE BOOK OF MORMON AND FAILED MISERABLY. SORRY, THERE IS NO WAY CONCIEVABLE THAT ANY MAN COULD PUT THIS BOOK TOGETHER, ESPECIALLY IN THE SHORT TIME THAT JOSEPH SMITH DID. BUT LIKE I SAID, KEEP TRYING. YOU ONLY STRENGHTHEN MY TESTIMONY.
OH BY THE WAY, IT IS INTERESTING TO WATCH ALL THE NEW INFORMATION COMING OUT OF SOUTH AMERICA. THEY CAN,T SEEM TO ANSWER MANY OF THE QUESTIONS THAT ARE ARISING FROM VAST AMOUNTS OF ARCHEOLICAL FINDS.
April 22, 2002
...Thank you for all your hard work and dedication to the truth. It has helped me stay away from the church and has proved invaluable to me in my efforts to enlighten my girlfriend to the true LDS church.
April 22, 2002
Subject: Plan of Happiness
I was a Mormon from 1969-83 and came out after much research, primarily of your materials. My mother-in-law, a Mormon, lives with us and I've notice a new phrase being used quite regularly now that I never heard while a church member.
I remember studying about the "Plan of Salvation," but now all I hear is about something called the "Plan of Happiness" with reference to (Alma 8:42). From my research of church literature, this subtle change occurred about 1995 with a talk from Dallin H. Oaks, "The Great Plan of Happiness," Ensign, Nov. 1993, 72. I'm wondering why this "switch" occurred. Might be interesting to research. Thanks again for your great work.
[Sandra's Note: You are right that in recent years LDS speakers have put greater emphasis on 'plan of happiness' over 'plan of salvation.' However, Neal Maxwell's writings are full of references to the Book of Mormon quotes on 'plan of happiness.' I think the emphasis started earlier than Dallin Oaks, although he might have made it more popular.
Interestingly, the Bible never mentions a 'plan of salvation' or a 'plan of happiness.' In fact, the King James version of the Bible never uses the word 'happiness.' Jesus said--
But he never put man's goal as finding 'happiness.' Mormonism has the emphasis on man and his quest for godhood, the Bible declares that man is to bring glory to God, not to himself. Ephesians 1:12 points out that "we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ." (See also Isa 43:7 & 21)]
April 22, 2002
Dear Jerald and Sandra
A few years ago I was part of a group of Christians who protested outside the opening of the first Mormon Temple in Africa. It is located (you prob know this in Johannesburg - SA)....
I have read a number of books on the Mormon church but yours is honestly the most researched and loving I have ever read. Congratulations you guys on an outstanding work and God bless you richly with all the persecution you are probably getting from such a wealthy church as the LDS. If you are ever in SA it would be great to meet you. I am now pastoring a church in Ficksburg (town in SA on the NW border of Lesotho)
April 22, 2002
Subject: God of the Bible
We have counted the names of at least fifteen Egyptian gods or goddesses which appear on the papyrus [Smith claimed to translate into the Book of Abraham] but it contains absolutely nothing regarding the God of the Bible.
Those 15 gods you counted are the GOD of Mormonism as well as the other gods of Egypt. The Egyptians really had only one God and the representations of multiple gods was purely symbolic to the one God.
This same concept applies to Christianity wherein there is THREE Gods but ONE in purpose; being the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. This understanding has been addressed by Egyptologiest James. P Allen who is the Curator of the Egyptian Exhibit in the Met, New York. I am afraid that you anti-Mormons are dealing with old information and you need to stay current.
The God in the Bible forbidded mankind to worhip idols but did never at any time command the Egyptians to NOT worship God. Will you say that God is not the God of the Egyptians? Will you say that God never at any time loved the ancient Egyptians? Such thought is folly. I say that the gods of the Egyptians were really the ONE TRUE GOD and the statues were nothing but stone and wood that cannot see, hear, or walk.
[Sandra's Note: Your reasoning would make confusion out of the whole Old Testament. One can not simply substitute the pagan dieties with the God of Israel. God instructed Moses and the Israelites to reject the gods of the Egyptians (Exodus 20).
In 1 Kings 22:52-53 we read of King Ahaziah that "he did evil in the sight of the Lord,...for he served Baal, and worshipped him, and provoked to anger the Lord God of Israel..." By your reasoning, Baal would be just another name for the true god.
God instructed Ezekiel to tell Israel "defile not yourselves with the idols of Egypt: I am the Lord your God." (Ez. 20:7)
By the way, you should read the article "The 'Breathing Permit of Hor'Thirty-four Years Later," in Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought (vol.33, no.4, Winter, 2000). It is written by Dr. Robert K. Ritner, Associate professor of Egyptology at the University of Chicago. He clearly demonstrates that the Egyptian papyri Joseph Smith owned have no relationship to Smith's supposed translation.]
April 22, 2002
Subject: Osiris & Isis
...I've carefully read Larson's book [By His Own Hand Upon Papyrus] and found that he raised many good points that Mormon scholars have tripped over. Other than that, his book is unEgyptian and his lack of knowledge is quite apparent. Now, I make no apologies for our (Mormon) beloved ithyphallic god called, Min [as represented in the Book of Abraham]. It is a representation of God's Almighty power. I see you have trouble with Isis turning into a falcon as she takes the phallus of Osiris.
Isn't this what married people do? They were joined in both life and death in the blessing of eternal marriage exactly as taught in Mormonism. It bothers me not one bit that Osiris gave seed to Isis any more than Heavenly Father did to Mary. Go figure.
...The phallus of the god Min as depicted in other portraitures of with uplifted left hand and erect phallus is a symbol of God's ability to create. It is a potent symbol of God's ability to bear children via the sacred phallus from which creation is made possible. It is by this power Jesus was conceived and is had by all those who become gods as taught in Mormonism.
In conclusion: Your explanations and judgments are, biased, incomplete, incorrect, and above--unEgyptian....
April 23, 2002
I would like to receive the Messenger.... I have been LDS for the last 17 years, and investigated it for 3 years prior to that. Now I have concerns and need all the info I can get. Thank you very much!
April 24, 2002
There were horses in the Americas at the time of the Book Of Mormon. Archaeologists have found that there were horses (they actually have evidence of it), not horses that we think of today, but smaller horses. It is a misconception that the Spaniards brought over horses. Spaniards did bring over the horses we are familiar with today but not the ones that they have found evidence of that lived here long before the Spaniards. This fact alone proves the validity and truthfulness of the Book Of Mormon. For years people who have claimed the Book Of Mormon to be false because of this fact. Now science has proved it to be true. How could a fourteen year old boy make up a story of horses being in the Americas and for decades people thinking it was wrong and then years later those people find that he was really right? ...
[Sandra's Note: While the Book of Mormon clearly states that both civilizations, the Jaredites and Nephites, had horses there is no archaeological evidence that horses existed here in the Americas during those times.
You mention that these were "not horses that we think of today, but smaller horses." These would still pre-date the Book of Mormon time period and could not fit the description of use as given in the Book of Mormon. According to the Book of Mormon, the horse must be large enough to pull a chariot with a rider (see Alma18:9; 20:6; 3 Nephi 3:22; 4:4; 6:1). This issue is dealt with in the book The Creation of the Book of Mormon by LaMar Petersen. See Appendix D by Stan Larson. Another good discussion of the problem is in New Approaches to the Book of Mormon.]
April 24, 2002
I have read through mateiral on your website, and I have a strong testimony of the the LDS church. Everything that I have read is either misenterpreted, false, and if i'm not sure, than it is too crazy of an idea to be true, so I ask you to please stop assuming things about my religion, and stop misenterpreting and criticizing it. It is really pathetic to research everything you can, find little details which someone who hated the church probably made up in the first place, and criticize it with stupid stories and misinterpretations. Please stop worrying about the LDS church, and start doing something useful with your time. If you don't believe in the church, than concentrate on yours, you can't feel Gods love if all you do is have contention with people who follow him. I know it is good to research, but please people, you go too far.
April 25, 2002
The Mormon god is very cruel to nonmember parents. They are not allowed to see their sons and daugters married [when the ceremony occurs in the temple]. My father has decided not to attend his grandaughter's wedding [where he would have to wait in a side room]. He feels that if he is not worthy to see the wedding he need not be there at all. Children are deprived of watching their sisters and brothers weddings. Many mormon children have never attended a wedding in their lives. The mormon god is one cold blooded deity. It is a far cry from Jesus making wine at the wedding he attended. I wonder if the missionaries pass this little tidbit of information out ...
April 25, 2002
Growing up in Wyoming, ... I would hear strange things about these Mormons. Now I Iive in Fort Collins, Co and people here know little about the LDS. I started to study the cult in my 30's (I am 49 ) and that was when I first heard of the Tanners. I listened to "Papa Bear" [former Mormon Dick Baer]...and that is when I found out how hard it is to leave the Mormons. That is also when I knew I needed to be compassionate towards them.
I just wanted to say what a blessing this ministry is. I pray that Mormon's come to my door, so I can bring them in and pray for them. How sad it is they don't know what living under grace is and they don't know the Jesus of the Bible. God is even bigger then the Mormon cult. Lord Bless you
April 26, 2002
Is there any official church statement, saying that Joseph Smith is from Jesus' lineage?
[Web-editor: See: LDS Leaders Claim to be Descended from Christ and His Apostles]
April 27, 2002
why don't you just concentrate on your religion and stop worrying so much about latter day saints. our beliefs are between ourselves and god. so if you weren't so threatened by the great number of converts and our church's growth. grow up and stop trying to twist the words of the book of mormon to your benefit. i love you because you are a child of God but i think that you are pathetic and you are judging lds people and for that i know that you will be judged. ...
April 28, 2002
Subject: Mountain Meadows Massacre
My question is in relation to the Mountain Meadows Massacre. I was discussing this with a young Mormon Elder who stated that the wagon train did not consist of innocent immigrants, but another band of persons like unto those who murdered Joseph Smith. He proceeded to tell me that "fully 85%" of the party were participants in Joseph Smith's murder. My question is; Is this an official story that the Mormon Church is teaching ?
Come to think of it now, the young man is contradicting himself in that he said as the LDS has been saying, that the LDS did not sanction the massacre and then proceeded to justify the massacre with his 85% statement.
Peace to you all,
[Sandra's Note: A description of the wagon train is given by David Bigler:
This hardly sounds like 85% of the group would contain the men who killed Smith. Joseph Smith died in 1844 in Illinois, not Arkansas. Why would these people be guilty? Also, anyone old enough to have helped kill Smith would presumably be at least 37 at the time of the Mountain Meadows Massacre in 1857, which would tend to eliminate 'young mothers' and 'dependent children.'
Besides, the major people accused of having a part in Smith's murder were known (see 'Carthage Conspiracy' by Oakes and Hill). Your friend is just repeating LDS propaganda without looking into the facts. See our Messenger #98: September 11th Massacre.]
April 28, 2002
Subject: I am saddened by the contents of this site
I am writing to tell you that I am saddened by the contents of this site. I am a member of this church and a follower of christ, it has always saddened me whenever I have tried to share the true gospel of christ and someone has slandered the teachings of the church because they did not understand the teachings of God.
I know that there are many things in the church that at first glance appear to be inconsistencies and things that are unfair but that is only a deception that the evil one pulls over the eyes of mankind to deceive them....just to help answer one of the questions I had about general authorities being "paid a moderate living expense" they are actually living the celestial law of consecration which Im sure you have read about in your study of church history.
but in general terms the people involved turn over all of their assets to the church and the church redistributes it evenly to all those involved so that their is sufficient for their needs and eventually, should everyone live the law, there would be sufficient for everyones wants.
I am no longer an official representative of the church because my mission ended 7 months ago but I am writing this in hopes that it will help you in some way to better understand the simple truth that God has restored his church to the earth in the these times and that that church is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, ...
April 28, 2002
I find it ironic that a mormon would criticize your site. By their own scriptures "all Christian sects are corrupt". By their definition they are ashamed of Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, and several of the early leaders. Obviously these men were "unchristian" by their own given definition of the term.
And lets not forget Jesus Christ. How "unchristian" can one get, after all he said Woe to You Scribes and Pharisees, Hypocrites...
Interesting isn't it they condemn the one they profess to have their Church Named after. Maybe they should remember the Book of Jude that we are to contend for the faith. Oh sorry I forgot they don't believe the Bible.
April 28, 2002
Subject: thank you!
Hello! I have been using the excellent information at your web site the last couple of days and I want to write and thank you for standing steadfast in the truth all of these years.
April 29, 2002
This could be a stupid question, however how is your Adolf Hitler article relevent to anything that pertains to real life? Is that a dumb question? Also I am curious if people actually care, I don't? ...
[Web-editor: See: The Mormon Church Attempts to Conceal Temple Records for Adolf Hitler.]
April 29, 2002
I just want to thank you for the excellent work you have done by bringing to light so much of what the Mormon Church tries so hard to hide. For years, I have felt that things just did not add up in the Mormon church, but I was reluctant to allow myself to read "anti-Mormon" literature because I thought it would be untruthfully biased.
Those inside the church that I talked to about your work seemed to immediately dismiss it as "anti-Mormon" lies. But having gone through your excellent work, I realize I owe a debt of gratitude for the years of work you have done to make it easier for me to digest factual examples of Church inconsistencies.
While I agree that much of your work seems to have a biased tone against the church, your sources and original research is well documented and very thorough.
My path away from the Mormon church has led me to look at all organized religion with greater scrutiny, and I admit I would currently describe my religious leanings as agnostic. Despite that my beliefs may be somewhat different from yours, I am extremely thankful for the work that you have done. And although I do not know you personally, I consider you dear friends.
Thank you so much for your contributions to the cause of truth.
April 29, 2002
Dear Sir/Madam, .... I work for Mormon Outreach Ministries ...Carlingford, Sydney. I have been doing a Book of Mormon Studies course at a Mormon Institute.
Our teachers are a missionary couple,...from Utah. [He] is a retired professor from BYU. Recently [he] taught us that Zohar Holy Kabbalah testifies to same doctrines as in the LDS Scriptures. He gave me an 8 page hand-out. Are there any Christian critiques on this issue? If so, please let me know. Good bye for now.
[Sandra's Note: Yes, there are similarities. But this is just another example of Smith's borrowing from existing thought to mold LDS teachings. The Zohar is part of Jewish mysticism. Jewish mysticism had an influence on Freemasonry, which in turn impacted Mormon doctrine and temple practices. Here are several references for further reading on the topic of the Kabbalah and Mormonism:
"Similarity of Priesthood in Masonry" The Relationship between Freemasonry and Mormonism, by Michael W. HomerDialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought, Vol. 27, No. 3, p.108, Fall 1994.
"Joseph Smith and Kabbalah: The Occult Connection", by Lance S. Owens. Dialogue, Vol. 27, No. 3.
The Refiner's Fire: The Making of Mormon Cosmology, 1644-1844, by John L. Brooke (New York Cambridge University Press, 1994).]
April 29, 2002
To whom it may concern: I quickly wanted to thank you for what you are doing. You have changed my life with your information and inspiration. ...Cordially,
April 30, 2002
...First off, We believe that we have our own free agency to exercise and choose between good and evil. What side do you think you and your website are on the Good Or Evil in God's eyes? ...Although we make mistakes, people who are faithful "don't" i repeat dont do drugs, drink alcohol, coffe, tea, caffine in general, masterbate, have pre marital sex. ...Can you even say you don't do one of those? If you don't more power to your, you are stronger than most but you probably cant say that. Do you even think those sins are wrong? My guess is no, right? ...
We try to treat everybody with respect and love each other as God loves us. We pray everyday go to church at 3 Hours on sunday. And best of all, we have faith and believe in the church of the Lord Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints....I am a faithful Mormon and know it to be true but do you have anything nice to say? One other thing is you do know what you post on your site is false and anti-christ right? Meaning, you are hating on our religion and posting false doctrine about it....
April 30, 2002
You should be afraid. I'm afraid for your souls. I do pity you for the wrath that Heavenly Father will lay upon you in the prison of your next life. You're sons and daughters of perdition. Lay hold of the iron rod and follow the straight and narrow path. Repent and be made clean again. Time is still on your side.
April 30, 2002
Dear Jerald & Sandra:
Just a quick note to tell you how much I enjoy your website. Although I am originally Utah-born, I am not a Mormon (nor will I EVER be) but have always been fascinated by the historical roots of Mormonism and its very creative doctrine. Your site is very informative, well balanced and well organized. I just finished reading "The Changing World of Mormonism" off the 'net and have learned even more about the LDS church and its interesting past. ...
I will continue to refer people who are "investigators" of Mormonism to your site for more information....
April 30, 2002
Hi Jerald and Sandra,
Bless you!!!! Thank you for all of your efforts!!! Glory to God for the impact that you have made in this world which is exposing the efforts of the enemy, allowing the light of truth to shine through the paynes of the windows of your lighthouse. Your efforts have touched me and many that I know, and are an inspiration to us all....
L....... (my wife) sister left the LDS fold, and 12 have e-mailed me privately...telling me that they have decided to leave Mormonism. Glory to God.
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